The Human Intimacy Podcast

The Bravery of Letting Go: A Deep Dive into Self-Forgiveness and Healing (Episode #63)

The Bravery of Letting Go:
A Deep Dive into Self-Forgiveness and Healing
 In this vulnerable and thought-provoking episode, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore one of the most challenging aspects of the healing journey: self-forgiveness. Whether you've acted in ways you're not proud of or internalized blame after betrayal, the burden of shame can keep you tethered to past pain. Together, they unpack why so many individuals—both betrayed partners and those who have acted out—struggle to forgive themselves, even long after change begins.
The conversation addresses the role of shame as a perceived protector, the internal dialogue that keeps us stuck, and how self-forgiveness isn’t just an emotional release, but a physiological and relational turning point. Drawing from Internal Family Systems (IFS), systems theory, trauma research, and recovery work, Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn examine how embracing self-forgiveness leads to renewed self-trust, authentic change, and deeper connection.
Listeners are also introduced to somatic and spiritual tools for letting go of self-judgment and are encouraged to explore their capacity to receive love—not just give it. The message is clear: your healing matters, and you are worthy of moving forward.
Resources Mentioned:
- Internal Family Systems (IFS) – A therapeutic model exploring parts of the self, especially protective parts tied to shame and fear.  - Mark Wolynn – Author of It Didn’t Start with You, discussing inherited family trauma and emotional tethering across generations.  - Dr. Joe Dispenza – Work referenced regarding emotional addiction and how familiar patterns of pain can become neurologically ingrained.  - Dr. Kristin Neff – [selfcompassion.org](https://selfcompassion.org), a resource hub for meditations and exercises on self-compassion and self-forgiveness.  - Dr. Carol Dweck – Growth vs. fixed mindset; how change is possible through effort and intentionality.  - Dr. Kevin Skinner –Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal, discussing concepts such as the locus of control and how misplaced self-blame limits healing.  - 12-Step Recovery Principles – Concepts of surrender, self-reflection, and spiritual healing in addiction recovery.  - Somatic Exercises for Releasing Shame – Bilateral stimulation, body scans, and metaphor-based visualization to help the body release emotional burdens.  - Visualization Practices – Inviting clients to connect with a Higher Power, or a loving internal figure like a grandparent, to find grace and compassion within.

The Shame We Carry: Giving Voice to the Unspoken (Episode 62)

The Shame We Carry:
Giving Voice to the Unspoken
In this special episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and co-host MaryAnn Michaelis delve into the profound impact of shame, secrecy, and silent suffering in relationships—especially in the context of sexual betrayal. They explore the internal negotiations we make with ourselves to hide the parts we fear will lead to rejection, and the cultural contradictions that often deepen our shame.
Drawing from decades of clinical experience, research, and personal insights, they emphasize that healing begins when we give voice to the unspoken. Whether it’s through journaling, therapy, or a safe disclosure process, naming our shame and speaking our secrets out loud—especially in safe spaces—can free us from isolation, enhance emotional and physical health, and open the door to deeper connection.
Listeners will learn how shame manifests in the body, how to recognize its signals, and why expressive writing and safe vulnerability are powerful healing tools. The conversation also highlights how shame affects both betrayed partners and those who have acted out, and how couples can begin to talk honestly—when the timing and safety are right.
Key Topics Covered:- The burden of silent suffering and hidden behaviors- The role of internal negotiation and self-deception- Cultural contradictions around sexuality and shame- The physiological impact of shame (e.g., depression, immune suppression)- The healing power of expressive writing and confession- How to recognize shame in the body- The need for safe environments for vulnerability and honesty- Why shame must be addressed in any path to relationship healing
Resources & References Mentioned:- Dr. James Pennebaker’s research on expressive writing and its impact on depression and immune health  - Brené Brown's work on vulnerability, shame, and the neuroscience of shame ("shame hits the brain like blunt force trauma")  - Anna Lembke’s quote: “Recounting our experiences gives us mastery over them”  - Discussion of shame-centered PTSD framework by Terry Taylor, visualizing shame at the core with different protective reactions (anger, avoidance, depression, addiction)  - Dr. Skinner’s 100-Day Courses for betrayed partners and those who have acted out, including targeted strategies to address shame  - Mention of the movie Frozen — and the lesson of “Let It Go” as a metaphor for releasing shame and emotional burdens
Takeaway Message: 
Shame thrives in silence. Healing begins when we find the courage and the safety to speak. Whether through writing, therapy, or trusted relationships, naming and voicing our hidden experiences gives us freedom, connection, and hope.

Forgiveness: The Misunderstood Path to Healing and Human Intimacy (Episode #61)

Forgiveness:
The Misunderstood Path to Healing and Human Intimacy
 In this heartfelt and powerful episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaels dive into the complex, often misunderstood topic of forgiveness—especially within relationships affected by betrayal and emotional wounds. Using real-life role-play, personal insight, and professional wisdom, they explore what forgiveness is—and isn’t.
Together, they examine the common misconceptions surrounding forgiveness, such as equating it with blind trust or minimizing deep pain. They clarify the distinctions between love, trust, and forgiveness, and how rebuilding trust must be an intentional and ongoing process. 
Drawing from Janis Abrahms Spring’s framework in How Can I Forgive You?, they outline four types of forgiveness:
Cheap forgiveness,
Refusal to forgive,
Acceptance,
Genuine forgiveness
Through this lens, they highlight the importance of emotional honesty, boundaries, and the reparative dance between the one who was hurt and the one who caused harm.
MaryAnn also introduces a reflective visualization exercise called “The Field of Grace”, inviting listeners to explore how and when to release the emotional burdens they've been carrying. Both Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn compassionately affirm that forgiveness is a process—not a moment—and that true healing often comes in unexpected ways.
This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating the difficult terrain of relational repair, self-awareness, or trauma recovery.
---
References & Resources Mentioned
 - Spring, J. A. (2004). How Can I Forgive You? The Courage to Forgive, the Freedom Not To. HarperCollins.  - Brown, B. (2015). Rising Strong*. Spiegel & Grau. (Referenced for the "marble jar" trust analogy)  - Skinner, K. (2017). Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal: The Essential Tools for Healing. KSkinner Publishing.  - Visualization Exercise: The Field of Grace, shared by therapist and colleague Karen Strange  - Concepts referenced from EFT (Emotionally Focused Therapy) and betrayal trauma research  - PTSD criteria related to betrayal trauma, particularly avoidance and emotional isolation  

From Self-Deception to Self-Trust: Honoring Emotions After Betrayal (Episode #60)

From Self-Deception to Self-Trust:
Honoring Emotions After Betrayal
In this deeply moving episode, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaels are joined by special guest Jennifer Johnson, a clinical mental health counselor and expert in betrayal trauma and sex addiction recovery. Together, they explore the nuanced concept of self-deception—not as a character flaw, but as a survival response often rooted in upbringing, family systems, and emotional safety.
They discuss how many betrayed partners struggle to trust their instincts and emotions, often minimizing their experiences or denying them altogether due to social conditioning, gaslighting, or fear of the truth. The conversation highlights the importance of self-awareness, emotional identification, and self-compassion as key steps toward healing and reclaiming authenticity.
Jennifer shares powerful insights on learning to honor emotions through body awareness, identifying internalized shame, and rediscovering one’s inherent worth. Dr. Skinner closes with a formula: Self-Compassion → Self-Trust = Authenticity—emphasizing that true intimacy begins with being real, both with ourselves and others.
---
 📚 Recommended Resources:
1. Books Mentioned:   - The Betrayal Bond by Patrick Carnes   - It Didn’t Start with You by Mark Wolynn   - No Bad Parts by Richard Schwartz (for Internal Family Systems)   - The Mindful Therapist by Dan Siegel (includes the COAL model)
2. Therapeutic Models Discussed:   - Internal Family Systems (IFS)   - EMDR and Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART)   - Somatic and trauma-informed emotional regulation strategies
3. Conference Resource:   - Visit HumanIntimacy.com to access the Human Intimacy Conference, including separate tracks for:     - Betrayal Trauma     - Sex Addiction     - Divorce Recovery     - Couples Healing
---
 💬 Assignment for Listeners:Take time to reflect on your own emotional awareness. Ask yourself:- What am I feeling right now?- Where do I feel it in my body?- Can I name this feeling without judgment?
Then, gently practice offering yourself loving kindness—the "L" in Dan Siegel’s COAL model—especially if this has been hard in the past. As Jennifer said, “You can’t heal what you can’t feel.”

Learning to Regulate Difficult Emotions: A Key to Thriving Relationships (Episode #59)

🎙️Learning to Regulate Difficult Emotions:
A Key to Thriving Relationships
 In this powerful post-conference episode of The Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore one of the most essential skills for emotional and relational well-being: affect regulation. Building on their recent discussion about resentment, this episode dives deeper into what happens when emotions become intense and overwhelming—and how we can respond skillfully, both individually and in our relationships.
Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn reflect on the lasting impact of the Human Intimacy Conference and shift into a grounded, thoughtful discussion about what causes emotional dysregulation, how our childhood experiences shape our emotional responses, and how to build the capacity to sit with and soothe difficult emotions. They emphasize the importance of self-attunement—the ability to recognize and regulate your own emotional state—and co-regulation, the process of calming and connecting with another human being.
MaryAnn shares insight from her background in music to explain how attunement works in relationships, and Dr. Skinner brings in science-based practices, including coherent breathing, attachment theory, and trauma-informed care. Together, they offer clear, compassionate steps for how to become more emotionally resilient, attuned, and connected.
---
📚 Key Concepts & Resources Discussed:
1. Affect Regulation Theory     - Based on Daniel Hill’s book *Affect Regulation Theory   - Regulated emotions = greater flexibility, calm, and relational effectiveness
2. Childhood Conditioning and Emotional Roles     - What we learned about emotions growing up shapes how we respond now     - Many people learned to hide or suppress emotions to stay safe
3. Self-Awareness & Attunement     - Learn to identify dominant emotions through reflection and body awareness     - Use tools like the Feelings Wheel and body scans to build emotional vocabulary
4. Co-Regulation in Relationships     - Eye contact, tone of voice, and presence all help regulate others     - Safe relationships can powerfully soothe emotional distress
5. HeartMath & Coherent Breathing     - Monitoring and lowering heart rate through intentional breathwork     - Self-regulation begins with learning to calm the nervous system
6. Physical Health & Emotional Resilience    - Sleep, nutrition, and exercise are foundational for affect regulation     - Emotional regulation improves when we care for the body
7. Dr. Bessel van der Kolk – The Body Keeps the Score     - Emphasizes group-based healing through music, dance, and movement
8. ADHD & Adaptation     - Recognizing unique regulation needs, such as background sound or movement
9. Mindfulness & the Brain     - Richard Davidson’s research on the neurological benefits of meditation     - Emotional presence strengthens with consistent mindfulness practice
10. Emotional Tolerance & Resiliency      - Being able to sit with and name difficult emotions reduces reactivity      - “You name it to tame it” – labeling emotions builds tolerance
11. Reframing Survival Skills      - Many coping strategies (like music, creativity, nature) are regulation tools      - Recognizing what already works and building on those strengths
---
💡 Takeaway Message:  Emotional regulation is not an inherited trait—it’s a learned skill. Whether you’re trying to manage your own inner world or support someone you love, learning how to identify, tolerate, and soothe difficult emotions is foundational for well-being. With awareness, intention, and support, we can all build these skills—and offer the gift of calm and connection in our most important relationships.

Overcoming Resentment: A Barrier to Connection and Healing (Episode #58)

Overcoming Resentment:
A Barrier to Connection and Healing  
In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, hosts Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis dive into the profound impact of resentment in relationships, particularly in the context of betrayal, trust, and healing. They explore how resentment stems from unmet expectations, unresolved hurts, and past wounds, and how it influences behavior and intimacy. Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn discuss the importance of self-reflection, emotional regulation, and honest communication in addressing resentment constructively. They also emphasize the role of attachment wounds in triggering resentment and how awareness of these wounds can help individuals process their emotions more effectively.  
The episode concludes with practical steps for recognizing and working through resentment, including self-reflection exercises, journaling, body awareness techniques, and healthy communication strategies. The hosts also announce a special discount for accessing the Human Intimacy Conference recordings, providing an opportunity to learn from top experts in the field.  
Key Resources Discussed:  1. 12-Step Support Groups (Step 10) – A daily practice for recognizing and addressing fear, anger, disappointment, and resentment.  2. Self-Reflection Questions for Processing Resentment:    - Do I find myself feeling angry, upset, or irritated toward someone?     - What specific event or experience triggered this resentment?     - What belief or core wound is attached to this resentment?     - Have I felt this way before in past relationships or childhood?     - How can I communicate my feelings in a way that fosters healing rather than blame?  3. EMDR Emotional Float-Back Technique – A guided method to trace current emotional reactions to earlier life experiences, identifying core wounds.  4. Dr. Sue Johnson's Attachment Theory – Understanding how unmet attachment needs create resentment and relational disconnection.  5. Pia Mellody’s Work on Trauma & Codependency – Exploring how resentment can keep individuals stuck in a victim mindset and how to shift to an empowered stance.  6. Healthy Communication Strategies – Differentiating between blame-driven resentment and honest, healing dialogue to create deeper understanding and emotional safety.  8. Human Intimacy Conference Recordings —Access to expert-led sessions on intimacy, betrayal healing, and relational repair, available at humanintimacy.com with the discount code: HIConference50 for 50% off—Available April 1st, 2025
This episode provides valuable insights and actionable tools to help listeners acknowledge, process, and communicate their resentment in a way that fosters growth and deeper intimacy.

Parenting Through Betrayal: Helping Children When You’re in Chaos (Episode #57)

Parenting Through Betrayal:
Helping Children When You’re in Chaos  
In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis discuss one of the most challenging aspects of betrayal—parenting while navigating your own trauma. When betrayal shakes a relationship, children often experience the ripple effects, sometimes without fully understanding what’s happening. The conversation explores the deep shame that both betrayed and betraying parents often feel, the impact of unspoken emotional tension on children, and the long-term effects of parental betrayal on a child’s development.  
Dr. Skinner shares personal experiences and insights on how betrayal influences family systems, emphasizing the importance of open, age-appropriate communication with children. MaryAnn highlights key strategies for disclosing difficult truths while prioritizing a child’s emotional well-being. The episode also offers guidance on avoiding parentification, navigating parental shame, and maintaining connection despite emotional overwhelm.  
The conversation underscores the importance of not only individual healing but also addressing the broader family system to foster resilience and long-term healing.  
---
Recommended Resources  
Books & Articles:1. Mending a Shattered Heart – Edited by Stefanie Carnes, PhD     A guide for partners navigating betrayal trauma, with a chapter on how and what to disclose to children. 
2. The Power of Attachment – Diane Poole Heller, PhD     Explores attachment trauma and how showing up even 30% of the time can foster secure connections. 
3. The Body Keeps the Score – Bessel van der Kolk, MD     Insights on how trauma is stored in the body and its impact on emotional regulation.  
4. Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal – Dr. Kevin Skinner     A deep dive into betrayal trauma and strategies for healing.  
Practical Tools for Parents:  
EMDR Therapy –     Consider finding an EMDR therapist to help process trauma and unspoken memories that may impact parenting.*  
Family Dialogue Guidelines:   - Keep disclosures age-appropriate.     - Avoid using children as emotional supports.     - Validate their feelings and reassure them that they are loved.     - Offer ongoing opportunities for discussion, rather than one-time conversations.  
---
Special Offer  
Human Intimacy Conference – March 14-15, 2025  Listeners can register with the coupon code Podcast50 for 50% off and receive a free Human Intimacy course of their choice. 
---
This episode is a must-listen for parents navigating betrayal trauma, offering compassionate guidance on maintaining connection with children while processing personal pain.

Finding the Right Support: How to Get Help After Betrayal and Addiction (Episode #56)

Finding the Right Support:
How to Get Help After Betrayal and Addiction 
  In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis discuss the crucial topic of seeking help after experiencing sexual betrayal, addiction, or trauma. They explore the different types of support available—family, friends, support groups, sponsors, therapy, and coaching—highlighting the importance of finding the right kind of help for each individual’s healing journey.  
Dr. Skinner shares research on the effectiveness of various support systems, emphasizing that meaningful support significantly improves recovery outcomes. MaryAnn adds insights on the power of connection in healing and why structured support, such as therapy and specialized groups, can be more effective than informal conversations with friends and family. They also discuss the growing role of coaching and the key differences between coaching and therapy, cautioning listeners to seek professional support for trauma-related issues.  
Additionally, they introduce the upcoming Human Intimacy Conference, featuring over 20 experts with a collective 400 years of experience in helping individuals and couples heal from betrayal and relationship challenges. The episode concludes with an invitation to explore available resources, including Dr. Skinner’s online support groups, courses, and the Human Intimacy Conference.  
Resources Mentioned:  
1. Support Groups & Recovery Programs:     - 12-Step Groups (S-Anon, SA, SAA, SLAA, etc.)     - CPTT betrayal trauma through IITAP     - APSATS (Association of Partners of Sex Addicts Trauma Specialists)     - NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) for general mental health support  
2. Professional Help:     - Certified Sex Addiction Therapists (CSATs)     - Trauma-focused Therapists (EMDR, ART, Somatic Therapy)     - Finding a specialized therapist via humanintimacy.com  
3. Educational Resources & Online Support:     - *Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal* by Dr. Kevin Skinner     - *Help Her Heal* by Carol Juergensen Sheets     - Dr. Skinner’s online courses and support groups (humanintimacy.com/supportgroup)     - The 100-Day Course: *100 Days to Healing from Sexual Betrayal*     - The 100-Day Course for Partners Who Acted Out Sexually  
4. The Human Intimacy Conference (March 2025):     - Pre- and post-conference expert interviews     - Live and recorded sessions from leading experts     - Free access to the 100-Day Healing Courses for registrants     - Registration at humanintimacy.com
Last chance to get a discount, use this coupon code: Podcast50 
This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating the complexities of healing from betrayal or addiction. It provides valuable guidance on choosing the right support system and highlights the importance of surrounding oneself with trusted, informed voices.

Navigating Attachment, Fear, and Connection in a Divided World with Michelle Mays (Episode #55)

Navigating Attachment, Fear, and Connection
in a Divided World  
  In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner is joined by Michelle Mays, author of The Betrayal Bind, to discuss the impact of betrayal trauma on attachment and how attachment plays a broader role in our relationships and society. Michelle shares insights from her experience as a licensed professional counselor and creator of the Attachment-Focused Partner Betrayal Model.  
The conversation delves into how fear affects our attachment systems, particularly in personal relationships and at a societal level. They explore how political and cultural divides create a sense of disconnection and anxiety, mirroring the dynamics seen in betrayal trauma. Michelle and Dr. Skinner discuss the importance of slowing down, recognizing fear-based responses, and fostering connection instead of falling into fight-or-flight behaviors.  
The discussion also highlights how betrayed partners often experience disorganized attachment, where their primary source of safety becomes a source of danger. Michelle explains how healing involves moving from disorganization back to secure attachment, both with oneself and with others. The episode concludes with practical strategies for overcoming fear-driven disconnection and promoting deeper, more meaningful relationships.  
Michelle also previews her upcoming talk at the Human Intimacy Conference*, where she will dive deeper into how attachment influences betrayal recovery and relationship repair.  
Resources Discussed in This Episode:  
1. Books & Authors:     - The Betrayal Bind by Michelle Mays     - Rebuilding Your Relationship After Sexual Betrayal by Dr. Kevin Skinner     - Willpower by Roy Baumeister     - Digital Minimalism by Cal Newport     - Intimate Interactions (referenced in discussion)  
2. Key Psychological Concepts:     - Attachment Theory (Bowlby, Shaver & Hazan)     - The Attachment-Focused Partner Betrayal Model (Michelle Mays)     - Disorganized Attachment & Betrayal Trauma     - Fight, Flight, Freeze Responses in Relationships     - Orienting Response & Nervous System Regulation  
3. Practical Strategies for Listeners:     - Slowing down before reacting to emotional triggers     - Identifying personal fear responses (fight, flight, or freeze)     - Practicing digital minimalism—choosing when and how to consume media     - Prioritizing human connection over power struggles in relationships and society     - Using curiosity and open-ended questions to navigate disagreements     - Recognizing and addressing deeper emotional needs in relationships  
4. Upcoming Event:     - The Human Intimacy Conference (March 14-15, 2025)       - Featuring Michelle Mays and other leading experts       - Early registration discount code: **50OFF** for $50 off  
This episode challenges listeners to examine their own attachment patterns, reflect on their fear responses, and foster deeper connections in a world that often promotes disconnection.

Gaslighting, Lies, and Healing: The Path to Rebuilding Trust After Betrayal (Episode #54)

Gaslighting, Lies, and Healing:
The Path to Rebuilding Trust After Betrayal
In this powerful episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner is joined by Dr. Sheri Denham Keffer, a nationally recognized expert on betrayal trauma and author of “Intimate Deception: Healing the Wounds of Sexual Betrayal.” Together, they dive deep into the topic of gaslighting—what it is, how it impacts betrayed partners, and why it is often more devastating than the betrayal itself. They discuss the psychological and emotional toll of deception, blame-shifting, and minimization, and how these behaviors contribute to trauma.  
Dr. Keffer shares personal experiences, research insights, and clinical expertise, highlighting how gaslighting leads to deeper levels of trauma and self-doubt. They explore the critical role of truth-telling in healing, the necessity of accountability, and how betrayed partners can begin to trust themselves again.  
The episode also touches on the role of therapy, common mistakes made in the healing process, and the dangers of “social gaslighting”, where the betrayer manipulates others into doubting the betrayed partner’s experience. Finally, Dr. Keffer shares details about her “Brave One Community”, an online support network for betrayed partners, and announces her upcoming presentation at the Human Intimacy Conference in March 2025.  
Resources Discussed:  
1. Dr. Sheri Keffer’s Book – Intimate Deception: Healing the Wounds of Sexual Betrayal     - Explores the impact of deception and betrayal on partners, offering tools for healing.  
2. Dr. Kevin Skinner’s Book – Rebuild Your Relationship After Sexual Betrayal   - Features a chapter on Gaslighting No More, helping couples navigate truth and trust-building.  
3. The Gaslighting Scale     - A research-based tool developed to measure the impact of gaslighting on betrayed partners.  
4. The Brave One Community    - An online support group for women healing from sexual betrayal.     - Special offer: One-month free membership at (https://braveone.com/intimacy)  
5. ERCEM Model (Early Recovery Couples Empathy Model)   - A structured approach to helping couples rebuild emotional connection after betrayal.  
6. Therapeutic Full Disclosure & Polygraph Process     - A structured process designed to establish truth and rebuild trust in relationships after betrayal.  
7. The Human Intimacy Conference (March 14-15, 2025)     - Featuring over 20 experts and 400+ years of combined clinical experience.     - Limited-time offer: 50% off registration with code 50OFF.  
This episode is a must-listen for anyone recovering from betrayal or seeking to understand the deep psychological effects of gaslighting.